Topics

My Banat family

 

Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
AndyL

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andy,

My husband is a Frauenhoffer. I’m looking in my Grosskomlosch book to help you. Are you saying Ignatz Lengenfelder was married to Margaret Fraunhoffer?


On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:22 AM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
AndyL

 

Hi Shannon, yes they were married 5 Sep 1886 in Vojtek. Witnessed by Joannes Fireneisz and Josephus Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives that were born in Ostern also such as Peter Frauenhoffer B:1785 who married Marianna Haag B:1876 in Ostern. They were married 9 Feb 1808 in Nakodorf.

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andrew, do you have the name of Margaret Fraunhoffer’s father? I have looked in all my books and have not found Ignatz Lengenfelder. There are quite a few Margaret Fraunhoffers so having her father’s name and possibly a bit more information might help. I also don’t see any Margarets listed as married to an Ignatz Lengenfelder.


On Jun 21, 2020, at 12:55 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Hi Shannon, yes they were married 5 Sep 1886 in Vojtek. Witnessed by Joannes Fireneisz and Josephus Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives that were born in Ostern also such as Peter Frauenhoffer B:1785 who married Marianna Haag B:1876 in Ostern. They were married 9 Feb 1808 in Nakodorf.

Cathy Reece
 

I have Oster FB.How can I help you?
Cathy

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020, 10:19 AM Shannon Frauenhoffer <Shannonf314@...> wrote:
Andy,

My husband is a Frauenhoffer. I’m looking in my Grosskomlosch book to help you. Are you saying Ignatz Lengenfelder was married to Margaret Fraunhoffer?


On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:22 AM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
AndyL

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Cathy,

I have three different sets of books but didn’t see what he is looking for. I asked for more information to try to help him.

Shannon


On Jun 22, 2020, at 4:48 PM, Cathy Reece <cre29ece@...> wrote:


I have Oster FB.How can I help you?
Cathy

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020, 10:19 AM Shannon Frauenhoffer <Shannonf314@...> wrote:
Andy,

My husband is a Frauenhoffer. I’m looking in my Grosskomlosch book to help you. Are you saying Ignatz Lengenfelder was married to Margaret Fraunhoffer?


On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:22 AM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
AndyL

Cathy Reece
 

Andy,
I have Ostern Family Book.
Who are you researching in Ostern?
Cathy

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020, 8:22 AM Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
AndyL

 

Hi Shannon, I show Margaret Fraunhoffer's father as Petri Fraunhoffer, B: 08Dec 1818 in Ostern, Her mother as Anna Marie Schreiner B:23Apr 1826 in Ostern. They were married in Vojtek 05Sep 1886 in Vojtek, witnessed by Joannes Firnesz and Hosephus Fraunhoffer. Got that from the church parish records in Ciacova which was the parish for Voitek until about 1908 when they got their own church. And I though that I had found a llnk to the Lengenfelder's origination. Thanks for the effort. AndyL

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andrew,

Peter Fraunhoffer b. 08 12 1818 Ostern, parents: Peter Fraunhoffer and Marianna Haag. The Horn book has him marrying Anna Maria Schreiner (daughter of Jakob Schreiner and Elizabeth Hermann) 26 11 1844 Ostern. 

Children:
1 Nikolaus         12 07 1847 Ostern
2 Jakob             27 09 1850 Ostern
3 Margarethe   23 02 1852 Ostern
4 Susanna        28 03 1854 Ostern
5 Josef             24 09 1856 Ostern
6 Gertraud       07 02 1858 Ostern
7 Katharine      17 02 1860 Ostern
8 Marianna      10 03 1862 Ostern
9 Katharina      09 11 1863 Ostern
10 Josef           23 04 1866 Ostern

Peter’s parents:
Peter Fraunhoffer b 15 12 1785 Ostern
                                d 03 03 1858 Ostern
                                m 09 02 1808 Nakodorf

Marianna Haag, daughter of Nikolaus Haag and Katharina NN (name unknown). She was born 06 09 1791 Nakodorf, died 03 03 1858 Ostern

Peter’s parents:
Franz Peter Fraunhoffer b 30 09 1755 Straubing
                                          d 04 09 1798 Ostern
                                          m 11 11 1777 Ostern

Anna Eckstein                  b around 1761
                                          d 26 06 1825 Ostern

Franz Peter’s parents:
Josef                              b 1726 Straubing
                                       d 27 08 1789 Ostern
                                       m around 1750

Anna Barbara Rebl, daughter of Rebl Tobias (Metzger) and Maria Anna (last name unknown)
                                      b 18 10 1729 Straubing
                                      d 01 04 1782 Ostern

That’s as far back as the Fraunhoffer line is shown in the book. Do you need the children for the couples or wives’ families?

Shannon


On Jun 22, 2020, at 5:53 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Hi Shannon, I show Margaret Fraunhoffer's father as Petri Fraunhoffer, B: 08Dec 1818 in Ostern, Her mother as Anna Marie Schreiner B:23Apr 1826 in Ostern. They were married in Vojtek 05Sep 1886 in Vojtek, witnessed by Joannes Firnesz and Hosephus Fraunhoffer. Got that from the church parish records in Ciacova which was the parish for Voitek until about 1908 when they got their own church. And I though that I had found a llnk to the Lengenfelder's origination. Thanks for the effort. AndyL

 

Hi Cathy, Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
Hi Shannon, I show Margaret Fraunhoffer's father as Petri Fraunhoffer, B: 08Dec 1818 in Ostern, Her mother as Anna Marie Schreiner B:23Apr 1826 in Ostern. They were married in Vojtek 05Sep 1886 in Vojtek, witnessed by Joannes Firnesz and Hosephus Fraunhoffer. Got that from the church parish records in Ciacova which was the parish for Voitek until about 1908 when they got their own church. And I though that I had found a llnk to the Lengenfelder's origination. Thanks for the effort. AndyL
AndyL

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andy,

I will recheck all of my books for Lengenfelder again tomorrow.


On Jun 22, 2020, at 10:14 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Hi Cathy, Hi, I am researching my family in the Banat. My grandfather was Phillip Lengenfelder b:1877 in Vojtek, my Grandmother was Katherine Krebs b;1879 Vojtek.I am looking to find out more about my GrGrandfather Ignatz Lengenfelder b;1850 in Komlos as was my GrGrandmother Margaret Fraunhoffer. I have other relatives born in Komlos(Ostern) as well which I can add later if someone has a Familybook of Ostern. I believe my Lengenfelder family came originally from Alsace-Lorraine. I have family tree info about the Krebs that go back to Switzerland and the Fraunhoffer to Straubing, Bavaria.
Any help would be nice, thanks. And a shout out to the keepers of this forum, what a great service.
Hi Shannon, I show Margaret Fraunhoffer's father as Petri Fraunhoffer, B: 08Dec 1818 in Ostern, Her mother as Anna Marie Schreiner B:23Apr 1826 in Ostern. They were married in Vojtek 05Sep 1886 in Vojtek, witnessed by Joannes Firnesz and Hosephus Fraunhoffer. Got that from the church parish records in Ciacova which was the parish for Voitek until about 1908 when they got their own church. And I though that I had found a llnk to the Lengenfelder's origination. Thanks for the effort. AndyL
AndyL

 

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andy,

I have no idea how I overlooked it but I found Ignaz! He was the oldest of 13!

Ignaz 10.02.1850 Groskomlosch
Father: Nikolaus Lengenfelder b 21.07.1838 Lovrin
              d 06.02.1886 Groskomlosch
              m 19.11.1849 Groskomlosch

Mother: Margarethe Firneis b 30.09.1829 Groskomlosch     d 23.10.1860 Groskomlosch

Nikolaus’s parents:  Heinrich Lengenfelder and Maria Magdalena Schaeffer

That’s all the information about the Lengenfelder side. There is more information about the Firneis side.



On Jun 22, 2020, at 11:42 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

Betty Wagner
 

Shannon:

If available I would like more information about the Firneis side.  I show a Frauenhofer connection further down this piece of my family tree

Jakob Burger b 1790 Hatzfeld
m. 1818 Gross Komlosch
Magdalena Firneisz b 1803 Gross Komlosch

  Child:
    Wendelin Burger b 1823 Gross Komlosch
    m. to Katharina Funk ? no info
      Child:
        Franz Burger b 1861 Gross Komlosch
        m. 1885 to Magdalena Dornecker (b 1862) in Heufeld
           Children:
             -  Nikolaus Burger b 1887 in Heufeld
             -  Katharina Burger b ? d about 1960 - no other info
                 m. to a Mr. Frauenhofer
                    They have a child Johann Frauenhofer
          

On 6/23/2020 1:46 PM, Shannon Frauenhoffer wrote:
Andy,

I have no idea how I overlooked it but I found Ignaz! He was the oldest of 13!

Ignaz 10.02.1850 Groskomlosch
Father: Nikolaus Lengenfelder b 21.07.1838 Lovrin
              d 06.02.1886 Groskomlosch
              m 19.11.1849 Groskomlosch

Mother: Margarethe Firneis b 30.09.1829 Groskomlosch     d 23.10.1860 Groskomlosch

Nikolaus’s parents:  Heinrich Lengenfelder and Maria Magdalena Schaeffer

That’s all the information about the Lengenfelder side. There is more information about the Firneis side.



On Jun 22, 2020, at 11:42 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

I will send it tonight or tomorrow!


On Jun 23, 2020, at 3:49 PM, Betty Wagner <banater@...> wrote:



Shannon:

If available I would like more information about the Firneis side.  I show a Frauenhofer connection further down this piece of my family tree

Jakob Burger b 1790 Hatzfeld
m. 1818 Gross Komlosch
Magdalena Firneisz b 1803 Gross Komlosch

  Child:
    Wendelin Burger b 1823 Gross Komlosch
    m. to Katharina Funk ? no info
      Child:
        Franz Burger b 1861 Gross Komlosch
        m. 1885 to Magdalena Dornecker (b 1862) in Heufeld
           Children:
             -  Nikolaus Burger b 1887 in Heufeld
             -  Katharina Burger b ? d about 1960 - no other info
                 m. to a Mr. Frauenhofer
                    They have a child Johann Frauenhofer
          

On 6/23/2020 1:46 PM, Shannon Frauenhoffer wrote:
Andy,

I have no idea how I overlooked it but I found Ignaz! He was the oldest of 13!

Ignaz 10.02.1850 Groskomlosch
Father: Nikolaus Lengenfelder b 21.07.1838 Lovrin
              d 06.02.1886 Groskomlosch
              m 19.11.1849 Groskomlosch

Mother: Margarethe Firneis b 30.09.1829 Groskomlosch     d 23.10.1860 Groskomlosch

Nikolaus’s parents:  Heinrich Lengenfelder and Maria Magdalena Schaeffer

That’s all the information about the Lengenfelder side. There is more information about the Firneis side.



On Jun 22, 2020, at 11:42 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

Cathy Reece
 

andy,
My Ostern FB lists Peter Fraunhoffer oo 26.11.1844 Anna Maria Schreiner in Ostern 

Spelling variation Franhoffer.

His wife AnnaMaria Schreiner is listed as dying in Wojtek 1873 which leads me to believe they are different villages.

Cathy
It looks like you,ve found other family.members!

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 12:42 AM Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

Karen Dalton Preston
 

The Hungarian name for Ostern is Kis-Komlos.  That may be the source of the confusion.  Gross-Komlosch is Nagy-Komlos in Hungarian.

—Karen

On Jun 23, 2020, at 5:19 PM, Cathy Reece <cre29ece@...> wrote:

andy,
My Ostern FB lists Peter Fraunhoffer oo 26.11.1844 Anna Maria Schreiner in Ostern 

Spelling variation Franhoffer.

His wife AnnaMaria Schreiner is listed as dying in Wojtek 1873 which leads me to believe they are different villages.

Cathy
It looks like you,ve found other family.members!

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 12:42 AM Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?



Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Sorry, I thought he was aware of that.

 

From: everybody@banat.groups.io <everybody@banat.groups.io> On Behalf Of Karen Dalton Preston
Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2020 4:23 PM
To: Banat.io List <everybody@banat.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [banat] My Banat family

 

The Hungarian name for Ostern is Kis-Komlos.  That may be the source of the confusion.  Gross-Komlosch is Nagy-Komlos in Hungarian.

 

—Karen



On Jun 23, 2020, at 5:19 PM, Cathy Reece <cre29ece@...> wrote:

 

andy,

My Ostern FB lists Peter Fraunhoffer oo 26.11.1844 Anna Maria Schreiner in Ostern 

 

Spelling variation Franhoffer.

 

His wife AnnaMaria Schreiner is listed as dying in Wojtek 1873 which leads me to believe they are different villages.

 

Cathy

It looks like you,ve found other family.members!

 

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 12:42 AM Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

 

 

 

Shannon Frauenhoffer
 

Andy,

 

Here is the Firneis information from the Grosskomlosch im Banat book by Nikolaus Horn (the previous information came from here as well):

 

Margarethe Firneis’s parents:

 

Johann Firneis

                B 17.11.1809 Grosskomlosch

                D around 1882 Wojtek

                M 22.02.1829 Grosskomlosch

 

Marianna Reding

                B 12.03.1810 Grosskomlosch

 

 

Johann’s parents:

 

Mathias Firneis

                B 18.01.1780 Kosmau

                D 20.12.1861 Grosskomlosch

                M 26.02.1797 Grosskomlosch

 

Elizabeth Lazarus

                B 21.11.1782 Charleville

                D 02.01.1854 Grosskomlosch

 

 

Mathias’s parents:

 

Mathias Firneis

                B around 1748 (no place listed)

                D 20.09.1808 Grosskomlosch

                M around 1768

 

Anna Maria (last name unknown)

                B around 1735 Bohmen

                D 24.09.1795 Grosskomlosch

 

 

Elizabeth Lazarus’s parents:

 

Franz Lazarus

                B around 1747 Lothringen

                D 18.02.1786 Charleville

                M 05.10.1773 Hommartingen

 

Veronika Meyer

                B around 1749

 

 

Franz Lazarus’s parents:

 

Michael Lazarus

Maria Anna Wittmann

 

It indicates there might be information about Michael Lazarus in the St Hubert book, but he isn’t listed in the book I have (Familenbuch St. Hubert – Charleville – Seultour). You and my husband are distantly related back through your Fraunhoffer lines though.

 

Let me know if I can help further. I have his tree in Ancestry under my username of shannonf314.

 

 

From: everybody@banat.groups.io <everybody@banat.groups.io> On Behalf Of Shannon Frauenhoffer
Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2020 4:18 PM
To: everybody@banat.groups.io
Subject: Re: [banat] My Banat family

 

I will send it tonight or tomorrow!



On Jun 23, 2020, at 3:49 PM, Betty Wagner <banater@...> wrote:



Shannon:

If available I would like more information about the Firneis side.  I show a Frauenhofer connection further down this piece of my family tree

Jakob Burger b 1790 Hatzfeld
m. 1818 Gross Komlosch
Magdalena Firneisz b 1803 Gross Komlosch

  Child:
    Wendelin Burger b 1823 Gross Komlosch
    m. to Katharina Funk ? no info
      Child:
        Franz Burger b 1861 Gross Komlosch
        m. 1885 to Magdalena Dornecker (b 1862) in Heufeld
           Children:
             -  Nikolaus Burger b 1887 in Heufeld
             -  Katharina Burger b ? d about 1960 - no other info
                 m. to a Mr. Frauenhofer
                    They have a child Johann Frauenhofer
          

On 6/23/2020 1:46 PM, Shannon Frauenhoffer wrote:

Andy,

 

I have no idea how I overlooked it but I found Ignaz! He was the oldest of 13!

 

Ignaz 10.02.1850 Groskomlosch

Father: Nikolaus Lengenfelder b 21.07.1838 Lovrin

              d 06.02.1886 Groskomlosch

              m 19.11.1849 Groskomlosch

 

Mother: Margarethe Firneis b 30.09.1829 Groskomlosch     d 23.10.1860 Groskomlosch

 

Nikolaus’s parents:  Heinrich Lengenfelder and Maria Magdalena Schaeffer

 

That’s all the information about the Lengenfelder side. There is more information about the Firneis side.

 

 



On Jun 22, 2020, at 11:42 PM, Andrew Lengenfelder via groups.io <andyl1937@...> wrote:

Nope, don't need families of wives... yet. If you have an ancestry.com account, there is one named Schuber StammBamm that has many of the same lines also taking the Fraunhoffers back to Straubing, Bavaria.
Thanks for the help. Why would the Lengenfelder not be in the book, Although in the church record he is listed as from Komlos, Arad which I thought was the same as Ostern, was I wrong?

 

Thank you very much for the information, almost overwhelming. Blessing to whoever published the Family Books and for you for sharing the information. One thing I noticed about the data for Nikolaus Lengenfelder, he was born 21.07.1838 but his marriage is in 12.11.1849, so he would be age 11. His son Ignatz was born 10.02.1850. Nikolaus would be age 11. His birth date must be incorrect, I'm guessing by about 10 years.
What do you think,
AndyL